After opening my exhibition at the Red House Centre, I attended a panel dialogue at the Centre’s lecture hall about the issues related to the Roma people in Bulgaria. Orhan Tahir was the moderator of that panel. At the discussion circle that was part of my exhibition opening, I was struck by how, even the educated Bulgarians who attended the circle, seemed oblivious to the problematic of racialization specially as it related to the Roma people. Blatantly racist comments were the norm. So, I was very happy to have the chance to attend the panel that was moderated by Orhan. There, I learned the systematic ways in which the Roma, like the Black population in North America, are discriminated against in spite of the heavy “integration” rhetoric of the European Union and its member states. I also learned about the specific problems of the “integration” schemes. I made spoke during the Q&A, and that catalyzed my introduction to Orhan. I followed that with a couple of meetings and eventually this recorded conversation in the weeks I was in Sofia.